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	<title>Comments on: Talent Build Dilemma</title>
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	<link>http://itankstuff.com/world-of-warcraft/uncategorized/talent-build-dilemma/</link>
	<description>in World of Warcraft and Heroes of Newerth</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Wed, 14 Jul 2010 14:07:37 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: Ohmymoogle</title>
		<link>http://itankstuff.com/world-of-warcraft/uncategorized/talent-build-dilemma/comment-page-1/#comment-3048</link>
		<dc:creator>Ohmymoogle</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 02 Apr 2009 05:09:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://itankstuff.com/?p=239#comment-3048</guid>
		<description>You cast divine shield while tanking boss ?

No wonder their pissed off at you and rightly so.


That is like adding more oil onto the fire. Your only adding to the problem.


Tanks are to tank the boss, and nobody else. But when you decide to bubble, the boss will then go to your friends and their dead and raid wipes because..... you felt healers were doing a crappy job so why not punish them to teach them and raid a lesson ???

The only reason you would be able to justify bubbling yourself is only if you communicated to an offtank with sufficient time for them to react who can immediately grab aggro after you bubble. If not, then yes your at fault.


Say for example if you were in Malygos 10 and your the only tank, you can not justify bubbling yourself ....

If healers are not healing you fast enough you should communicate to them and/or raid leader to get the healers to up their game.... it&#039;s either the healers are slowpokes at healing, they are undergeared, or it is your gear/gems/enchants/talents that is making it hard for them to heal you, or you yourself are undergeared ..... you need to communicate with the healers to find out which is the problem, then fix that, rather then wiping raid just to prove a point o_O;

I lead many pug raids and i make it a point to inspect everyones gear so i can decide if they can tank, dps or heal...  so that is one issue out of the way. Any problem with healing would then be healers incompetence which i try to ask them to do better or i replace them with healers that understand healing is a whack a mole speed concept :X

What i found healers like is having time to react for heals, meaning the tanks should have lots of stamina, lots of avoidance.

27k Hp is usually the norm for a raid tank.

540 defense. My defense is currently 550 but i want to get it to 560.

dodge ( after i am def capped i usually pump a lot into dodge ). My dodge is roughly 26-27 %

Parry ( i don&#039;t really go out of my way to max this out, i only even out the stats so it&#039;s not too big a gap between dodge and parry ). My parry is roughly 19-20%

Block = 14% is i remember correctly. Because of my low block i usually spam Holy Shield and ensure it is active all the time. I only invest in little block so that total avoidance reaches 102% Any block after that i read is not useful.

[Block ( this is after holy shield is active ) + dodge + parry = total avoidance.]

102% - total avoidance = roughly how much avoidance or block you need to reach the block cap.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You cast divine shield while tanking boss ?</p>
<p>No wonder their pissed off at you and rightly so.</p>
<p>That is like adding more oil onto the fire. Your only adding to the problem.</p>
<p>Tanks are to tank the boss, and nobody else. But when you decide to bubble, the boss will then go to your friends and their dead and raid wipes because.…. you felt healers were doing a crappy job so why not punish them to teach them and raid a lesson ???</p>
<p>The only reason you would be able to justify bubbling yourself is only if you communicated to an offtank with sufficient time for them to react who can immediately grab aggro after you bubble. If not, then yes your at fault.</p>
<p>Say for example if you were in Malygos 10 and your the only tank, you can not justify bubbling yourself .…</p>
<p>If healers are not healing you fast enough you should communicate to them and/or raid leader to get the healers to up their game.… it’s either the healers are slowpokes at healing, they are undergeared, or it is your gear/gems/enchants/talents that is making it hard for them to heal you, or you yourself are undergeared .…. you need to communicate with the healers to find out which is the problem, then fix that, rather then wiping raid just to prove a point o_O;</p>
<p>I lead many pug raids and i make it a point to inspect everyones gear so i can decide if they can tank, dps or heal…  so that is one issue out of the way. Any problem with healing would then be healers incompetence which i try to ask them to do better or i replace them with healers that understand healing is a whack a mole speed concept :X</p>
<p>What i found healers like is having time to react for heals, meaning the tanks should have lots of stamina, lots of avoidance.</p>
<p>27k Hp is usually the norm for a raid tank.</p>
<p>540 defense. My defense is currently 550 but i want to get it to 560.</p>
<p>dodge ( after i am def capped i usually pump a lot into dodge ). My dodge is roughly 26–27 %</p>
<p>Parry ( i don’t really go out of my way to max this out, i only even out the stats so it’s not too big a gap between dodge and parry ). My parry is roughly 19–20%</p>
<p>Block = 14% is i remember correctly. Because of my low block i usually spam Holy Shield and ensure it is active all the time. I only invest in little block so that total avoidance reaches 102% Any block after that i read is not useful.</p>
<p>[Block ( this is after holy shield is active ) + dodge + parry = total avoidance.]</p>
<p>102% — total avoidance = roughly how much avoidance or block you need to reach the block cap.</p>
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		<title>By: Nyrox</title>
		<link>http://itankstuff.com/world-of-warcraft/uncategorized/talent-build-dilemma/comment-page-1/#comment-2880</link>
		<dc:creator>Nyrox</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Mar 2009 05:16:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://itankstuff.com/?p=239#comment-2880</guid>
		<description>i cant believe u dont like Seals of the pure its 15% more damage on ur judgements and the tick on your seal of vengence/coruption  that&#039;s more tps  but now im torn between that or divinity or conviction ive heard tht takin conviction greatly increases your tps but is it really more than SOTP  is conviction worth puuting 5 in over divinity and judgements of the just man teh days of teh cookie cutter spec where so easy damn u blizz XD</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>i cant believe u dont like Seals of the pure its 15% more damage on ur judgements and the tick on your seal of vengence/coruption  that’s more tps  but now im torn between that or divinity or conviction ive heard tht takin conviction greatly increases your tps but is it really more than SOTP  is conviction worth puuting 5 in over divinity and judgements of the just man teh days of teh cookie cutter spec where so easy damn u blizz XD</p>
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		<title>By: Dann</title>
		<link>http://itankstuff.com/world-of-warcraft/uncategorized/talent-build-dilemma/comment-page-1/#comment-2507</link>
		<dc:creator>Dann</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 25 Feb 2009 11:49:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://itankstuff.com/?p=239#comment-2507</guid>
		<description>Well that is the best news i&#039;ve heard all day. Thanks Aurei</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well that is the best news i’ve heard all day. Thanks Aurei</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Aureilie</title>
		<link>http://itankstuff.com/world-of-warcraft/uncategorized/talent-build-dilemma/comment-page-1/#comment-2506</link>
		<dc:creator>Aureilie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 25 Feb 2009 10:51:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://itankstuff.com/?p=239#comment-2506</guid>
		<description>That&#039;s a bug in the mmochampion calculator and has been confirmed that you can get AD without Reckoning on the PTR.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That’s a bug in the mmochampion calculator and has been confirmed that you can get AD without Reckoning on the PTR.</p>
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		<title>By: Dann</title>
		<link>http://itankstuff.com/world-of-warcraft/uncategorized/talent-build-dilemma/comment-page-1/#comment-2505</link>
		<dc:creator>Dann</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 25 Feb 2009 10:45:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://itankstuff.com/?p=239#comment-2505</guid>
		<description>Hey Tep,

They&#039;re making it so that &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.wowhead.com/?spell=31854&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Ardent Defender&lt;/a&gt; requires 5/5 Reckoning.

Obviously it&#039;s still on the Beta so we dont know that this will go live. But at the moment it looks like we&#039;ll be grabbing 5/5 Reckoning.

You can check out the new Trees &lt;a href=&quot;http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?paladin&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;@mmochampion&lt;/a&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey Tep,</p>
<p>They’re making it so that <a href="http://www.wowhead.com/?spell=31854" rel="nofollow">Ardent Defender</a> requires 5/5 Reckoning.</p>
<p>Obviously it’s still on the Beta so we dont know that this will go live. But at the moment it looks like we’ll be grabbing 5/5 Reckoning.</p>
<p>You can check out the new Trees <a href="http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?paladin" rel="nofollow">@mmochampion</a></p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Tepisor</title>
		<link>http://itankstuff.com/world-of-warcraft/uncategorized/talent-build-dilemma/comment-page-1/#comment-2502</link>
		<dc:creator>Tepisor</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 25 Feb 2009 07:12:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://itankstuff.com/?p=239#comment-2502</guid>
		<description>Why would you be forced to grab Reckoning?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Why would you be forced to grab Reckoning?</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Dirz</title>
		<link>http://itankstuff.com/world-of-warcraft/uncategorized/talent-build-dilemma/comment-page-1/#comment-2501</link>
		<dc:creator>Dirz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 25 Feb 2009 06:21:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://itankstuff.com/?p=239#comment-2501</guid>
		<description>It is good that you havent lost agro but is that because the dps had to slacken or was it because you were dancing properly (I love beiing able to use heigan terminology again:))  The problem with using divine shield while tanking is it means you arent doing your job.  When yuo bubble and the mobs go elsewhere that is BAD, as it means you need to pick them up again- the hardest part about being a tank is trusting your healer, even in a random pug, to heal you without you always twitching to hit one of our oh shiiit buttons.  That said once 3.1 comes out we wont be having these issues as much, although I&#039;ll be forced to grab reckoning...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It is good that you havent lost agro but is that because the dps had to slacken or was it because you were dancing properly (I love beiing able to use heigan terminology again:))  The problem with using divine shield while tanking is it means you arent doing your job.  When yuo bubble and the mobs go elsewhere that is BAD, as it means you need to pick them up again– the hardest part about being a tank is trusting your healer, even in a random pug, to heal you without you always twitching to hit one of our oh shiiit buttons.  That said once 3.1 comes out we wont be having these issues as much, although I’ll be forced to grab reckoning…</p>
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		<title>By: Furiouslight</title>
		<link>http://itankstuff.com/world-of-warcraft/uncategorized/talent-build-dilemma/comment-page-1/#comment-2484</link>
		<dc:creator>Furiouslight</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 24 Feb 2009 19:31:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://itankstuff.com/?p=239#comment-2484</guid>
		<description>Normally, people know me as Shadowsilk on Garrosh. My level 80 Rogue and just wanted to introduce myself say hello and post a few comments. 

I recently was asked by the guild since I play regularly to level up a Paladin Tank as its the one toon I had closer to level. I leveled to 70 as Retribution and have recently respecced and began gearing as a tank. 

I have chosen an extremely interesting spec and despite criticism am excited to test it at level 80 where I believe the effectiveness will shine. 

However, like you I do not use SoR or SoV as my tanking Seal. I usually have up SoW or SoL. I tend to judge with JoL or JoW respectively and never have needed to judge with JoJ. 

I took Divine Guardian and for what I believe was with purpose. Some people constructively criticized my use of Divine Shield while tanking. Mainly, because of the loss of aggro. However, I use it to breathe. If in a situation with a poor Main Healer appearing as though they are specced for group heals, I force them to play their healer so they are giving the heals how I need them and I effectively reduce the penalty for dropping aggro by absorbing the damage into the shield instead of the way Hand of Sacrifice transfers the damage to me. 

Also, I will be taking Deflection, Benediction, Improved Judgements, Heart of the Crusader and Sanctified Seals. I may possibly change this from Benediction to Conviction if I can find a way to reduce the time I am OOM. 

Currently at Level 70 and at Def for level +123 I am absorbing 62% of the damage on runs and Have yet to loose aggro. 

Anyway, I hope my justification for taking the points in Divine Guardian were well explained, however, I am open to suggestions.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Normally, people know me as Shadowsilk on Garrosh. My level 80 Rogue and just wanted to introduce myself say hello and post a few comments. </p>
<p>I recently was asked by the guild since I play regularly to level up a Paladin Tank as its the one toon I had closer to level. I leveled to 70 as Retribution and have recently respecced and began gearing as a tank. </p>
<p>I have chosen an extremely interesting spec and despite criticism am excited to test it at level 80 where I believe the effectiveness will shine. </p>
<p>However, like you I do not use SoR or SoV as my tanking Seal. I usually have up SoW or SoL. I tend to judge with JoL or JoW respectively and never have needed to judge with JoJ. </p>
<p>I took Divine Guardian and for what I believe was with purpose. Some people constructively criticized my use of Divine Shield while tanking. Mainly, because of the loss of aggro. However, I use it to breathe. If in a situation with a poor Main Healer appearing as though they are specced for group heals, I force them to play their healer so they are giving the heals how I need them and I effectively reduce the penalty for dropping aggro by absorbing the damage into the shield instead of the way Hand of Sacrifice transfers the damage to me. </p>
<p>Also, I will be taking Deflection, Benediction, Improved Judgements, Heart of the Crusader and Sanctified Seals. I may possibly change this from Benediction to Conviction if I can find a way to reduce the time I am OOM. </p>
<p>Currently at Level 70 and at Def for level +123 I am absorbing 62% of the damage on runs and Have yet to loose aggro. </p>
<p>Anyway, I hope my justification for taking the points in Divine Guardian were well explained, however, I am open to suggestions.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Tepisor</title>
		<link>http://itankstuff.com/world-of-warcraft/uncategorized/talent-build-dilemma/comment-page-1/#comment-2310</link>
		<dc:creator>Tepisor</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 31 Jan 2009 10:24:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://itankstuff.com/?p=239#comment-2310</guid>
		<description>It all goes down to your style of play: blessings, rotations, gear, all the shizzle.

If you get the job done, don&#039;t think anyone will complain that you&#039;re using BoK instead of BoSanc or the other way around.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It all goes down to your style of play: blessings, rotations, gear, all the shizzle.</p>
<p>If you get the job done, don’t think anyone will complain that you’re using BoK instead of BoSanc or the other way around.</p>
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		<title>By: Aureilie</title>
		<link>http://itankstuff.com/world-of-warcraft/uncategorized/talent-build-dilemma/comment-page-1/#comment-2309</link>
		<dc:creator>Aureilie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 31 Jan 2009 00:29:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://itankstuff.com/?p=239#comment-2309</guid>
		<description>Actually, it&#039;s situational. If you are at gear level, or above gear level, for the content, BoSanc is better, being that you get the mana return. If you&#039;re below gear level, Kings is actually better because of the boost to avoidance, mitigation and stamina it will net you. Obviously though, having both is best. ^-^</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Actually, it’s situational. If you are at gear level, or above gear level, for the content, BoSanc is better, being that you get the mana return. If you’re below gear level, Kings is actually better because of the boost to avoidance, mitigation and stamina it will net you. Obviously though, having both is best. ^-^</p>
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